AMSOIL DOT4 Brake Fluid - Track Review!
Aug 13, 2009, 02:20 PM
#1
AMSOIL DOT4 Brake Fluid - Track Review!
I've been tracking my car for about 3.5 years now. I've got about 35 or so events under my belt. I've went through 3 sets of rotors, 5 sets of front pads, countless nights of brake bleeds, multiple brake fluid flushes, etc. I've had weekends with a solid pedal, a spongy pedal, I've cut session short because of hot fluid and even went off track because of boiled fluid and a total and complete loss of brakes.
I'll detail out the changes I've made over the years, what has worked, what hasn't and where I'm at now. Probably way more detail than is needed, but hopefully it will come in handy for someone.
Bottom line; just switched to AMSOIL DOT4 fluid and loving it!
2006
- Stock fluid
- Stock pads
- Stock rotors
2007
- Motul fluid
- PF Z / PFC01 front pads
- 255 RA1's
2008
- Motul fluid
- Hawk DTC60 pads
- Goodridge SS lines
- SP Performance front slotted rotors (rear stock)
- Front Ti backing shims
- Forge Air Cooling Ducts
- 255 NT01's
2009
- Motul fluid - (through July/2009)
- AMSOIL DOT4 fluid - (as of Aug/2009)
- Hawk DTC60 pads
- Goodridge SS lines
- 'Blank' replacement front rotors (rear stock)
- Front Ti backing shims
- Forge Air Cooling Ducts
- 245 Hoosier R6
Mid-year I had a few offs because of boiled fluid. I think this was partially due to lack of airflow in the routing of my forge cooling ducts. But I really think the Motul should have handled it. One of these was a very scary departure where I left the track at 94mph (via traqmate) and was just fortunate there was enough runoff to slide to a stop.
I switched the car to AMSOIL engine oil. See thread HERE for more info. I also learned they had a DOT4 brake fluid that was similar to Motul. Since I had some issues already with losing my brakes and/or a soft pedal and the constant need to bleed, I figured I'd give it a shot as the specs were very similar. So I called up our local forum expert - Andy (apagan01) on the forums - and placed an order.
My first event with the AMSOIL DOT4 fluid was last weekend at BlackHawk Farms Raceway in Northern IL - nearly Wisconsin. Blackhawk is known as a brutal track on the brakes so it was going to be a great test. It was also forecasted to be around 95+ with a heat index of 105+.
Not once the entire weekend did I have an issue with the pedal. I ran full 15-20min sessions (4-5 per day) and I ran them hard. I would have usually had a slightly soft pedal and would have spent Sat evening bleeding the brakes - but I didn't bother. Instead just had a
and relaxed.Stay tuned for a detailed review on the install/flush process and my first track weekend.
Last edited by boomn29; Aug 13, 2009 at 02:29 PM.
Aug 13, 2009, 02:20 PM
#2
Details on brake fluid flushing/bleeding and pics!
There's a few nice writeups in the how-to section on this. I definitely recommend checking those out for the best methods. If you have specific questions; just post up here and I'll see if I can help. There's multiple ways to flush/bleed including the 2-person pedal method, sucking fluid out with a hand-held device or pushing fluid out with a power bleeder. I use the latter; a Motive Power Bleeder (below). It puts constant pressure on the brake system so it's a 1-person job. Just need your catch container and an 11mm wrench. Please please don't try to make a 7/16" work as you'll eventually round off the bleeder nipples...ask me how I know.
Pictured below is the RR tire. You can see the catchcan (aka a soda bottle with plastic tubing in it) present and the tubing connected to one of the bleeder valves. The nipple has been loosened and with the pressure on the system from the Motive Power Bleeder, the fluid runs right out. If you're just bleeding the system, you don't need to release much really. However if you see any air bubbles; keep bleeding until NONE are left.
In the past when I used Motul fluid, I would always have air bubbles in the both of the fronts. Also the first bit of fluid would be a darker brown color. If you see any of this, make sure to run it ALL out. In July when I lost my brakes completely after boiling my Motul fluid, I had to run 1.5 bottles through the front brakes just to get rid of the air bubbles.
Lastly, make sure to be clean. Brake cleaner works great to dry up everything and then wipe down your calipers and the floor if needed. Make sure to not get any fluid in your eyes, I hear it's rather painful. Also keep all fluid away from your paint, I think it'll eat it. It's not a tough job at all.
Lastly, here's a current shot of my RF rotor and caliper. They've both got some life on them.
There's a few nice writeups in the how-to section on this. I definitely recommend checking those out for the best methods. If you have specific questions; just post up here and I'll see if I can help. There's multiple ways to flush/bleed including the 2-person pedal method, sucking fluid out with a hand-held device or pushing fluid out with a power bleeder. I use the latter; a Motive Power Bleeder (below). It puts constant pressure on the brake system so it's a 1-person job. Just need your catch container and an 11mm wrench. Please please don't try to make a 7/16" work as you'll eventually round off the bleeder nipples...ask me how I know.
Pictured below is the RR tire. You can see the catchcan (aka a soda bottle with plastic tubing in it) present and the tubing connected to one of the bleeder valves. The nipple has been loosened and with the pressure on the system from the Motive Power Bleeder, the fluid runs right out. If you're just bleeding the system, you don't need to release much really. However if you see any air bubbles; keep bleeding until NONE are left.
In the past when I used Motul fluid, I would always have air bubbles in the both of the fronts. Also the first bit of fluid would be a darker brown color. If you see any of this, make sure to run it ALL out. In July when I lost my brakes completely after boiling my Motul fluid, I had to run 1.5 bottles through the front brakes just to get rid of the air bubbles.
Lastly, make sure to be clean. Brake cleaner works great to dry up everything and then wipe down your calipers and the floor if needed. Make sure to not get any fluid in your eyes, I hear it's rather painful. Also keep all fluid away from your paint, I think it'll eat it. It's not a tough job at all.
Lastly, here's a current shot of my RF rotor and caliper. They've both got some life on them.
Last edited by boomn29; Aug 14, 2009 at 08:15 AM.
Aug 13, 2009, 03:18 PM
#3
Nathan you are in good hands with the AMSOIL Racing Brake fluid DOT 600
As the brake system heats up, brake fluids with low boiling points begin to vaporize. The brake pedal must travel further to apply the same amount of force on the brakes, causing a spongy feeling. If enough of the brake fluid vaporizes, brake system failure may occur. Brake fluid boiling points are measured on two separate scales:
Dry equilibrium reflux boiling point (ERBP) - the boiling point of new, freshly-opened, unused fluid.
Wet ERBP - the boiling point of a brake fluid after it has absorbed three percent water.
AMSOIL Series 600 DOT 4 Racing Brake Fluid is formulated with the best zinc-based anti-corrosion additives and pH stabilizers. It is designed for high-temperature stability, yet flows easily at low temperatures
As the brake system heats up, brake fluids with low boiling points begin to vaporize. The brake pedal must travel further to apply the same amount of force on the brakes, causing a spongy feeling. If enough of the brake fluid vaporizes, brake system failure may occur. Brake fluid boiling points are measured on two separate scales:
Dry equilibrium reflux boiling point (ERBP) - the boiling point of new, freshly-opened, unused fluid.
Wet ERBP - the boiling point of a brake fluid after it has absorbed three percent water.
AMSOIL Series 600 DOT 4 Racing Brake Fluid is formulated with the best zinc-based anti-corrosion additives and pH stabilizers. It is designed for high-temperature stability, yet flows easily at low temperatures
Aug 15, 2009, 08:07 AM
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Aug 15, 2009, 01:10 PM
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59 1/2 LOL
No I am not 60.. Getting up there in the B-Days but still having fun. Love what I do for a living and it gives me an opportunity to do something else I love which is ride my Motorcycle. It is just 2 yrs old and has over 36,000 miles on it.
LG
No I am not 60.. Getting up there in the B-Days but still having fun. Love what I do for a living and it gives me an opportunity to do something else I love which is ride my Motorcycle. It is just 2 yrs old and has over 36,000 miles on it.
LG
Aug 15, 2009, 01:26 PM
#9
Details on brake fluid flushing/bleeding and pics!
There's a few nice writeups in the how-to section on this. I definitely recommend checking those out for the best methods. If you have specific questions; just post up here and I'll see if I can help. There's multiple ways to flush/bleed including the 2-person pedal method, sucking fluid out with a hand-held device or pushing fluid out with a power bleeder. I use the latter; a Motive Power Bleeder (below). It puts constant pressure on the brake system so it's a 1-person job. Just need your catch container and an 11mm wrench. Please please don't try to make a 7/16" work as you'll eventually round off the bleeder nipples...ask me how I know.
Pictured below is the RR tire. You can see the catchcan (aka a soda bottle with plastic tubing in it) present and the tubing connected to one of the bleeder valves. The nipple has been loosened and with the pressure on the system from the Motive Power Bleeder, the fluid runs right out. If you're just bleeding the system, you don't need to release much really. However if you see any air bubbles; keep bleeding until NONE are left.
In the past when I used Motul fluid, I would always have air bubbles in the both of the fronts. Also the first bit of fluid would be a darker brown color. If you see any of this, make sure to run it ALL out. In July when I lost my brakes completely after boiling my Motul fluid, I had to run 1.5 bottles through the front brakes just to get rid of the air bubbles.
Lastly, make sure to be clean. Brake cleaner works great to dry up everything and then wipe down your calipers and the floor if needed. Make sure to not get any fluid in your eyes, I hear it's rather painful. Also keep all fluid away from your paint, I think it'll eat it. It's not a tough job at all.
Lastly, here's a current shot of my RF rotor and caliper. They've both got some life on them.
There's a few nice writeups in the how-to section on this. I definitely recommend checking those out for the best methods. If you have specific questions; just post up here and I'll see if I can help. There's multiple ways to flush/bleed including the 2-person pedal method, sucking fluid out with a hand-held device or pushing fluid out with a power bleeder. I use the latter; a Motive Power Bleeder (below). It puts constant pressure on the brake system so it's a 1-person job. Just need your catch container and an 11mm wrench. Please please don't try to make a 7/16" work as you'll eventually round off the bleeder nipples...ask me how I know.
Pictured below is the RR tire. You can see the catchcan (aka a soda bottle with plastic tubing in it) present and the tubing connected to one of the bleeder valves. The nipple has been loosened and with the pressure on the system from the Motive Power Bleeder, the fluid runs right out. If you're just bleeding the system, you don't need to release much really. However if you see any air bubbles; keep bleeding until NONE are left.
In the past when I used Motul fluid, I would always have air bubbles in the both of the fronts. Also the first bit of fluid would be a darker brown color. If you see any of this, make sure to run it ALL out. In July when I lost my brakes completely after boiling my Motul fluid, I had to run 1.5 bottles through the front brakes just to get rid of the air bubbles.
Lastly, make sure to be clean. Brake cleaner works great to dry up everything and then wipe down your calipers and the floor if needed. Make sure to not get any fluid in your eyes, I hear it's rather painful. Also keep all fluid away from your paint, I think it'll eat it. It's not a tough job at all.
Lastly, here's a current shot of my RF rotor and caliper. They've both got some life on them.
Dam Nathan, those brakes have been thrue some heat cycles
Aug 31, 2009, 07:47 PM
#12
Had another day on track this weekend with the AMSOIL DOT4 brake fluid. Had to hotlap the car a bit as I was instructing for the SCCA and had to do some customer ride-alongs as well. Brakes held up perfectly even though it was warm enough to get my tires very very greasy (Hoosier R6's; with a lotta heat cycles).
Tossed on some new 1-piece rotors tonight. Here's a pic of my old rotors vs a new one.
I also took the opportunity to replace one of my Brembo calipers while I was at it. Here's a pic of one of my original calipers vs a nearly new one I picked up.
Tossed on some new 1-piece rotors tonight. Here's a pic of my old rotors vs a new one.
I also took the opportunity to replace one of my Brembo calipers while I was at it. Here's a pic of one of my original calipers vs a nearly new one I picked up.
Sep 8, 2009, 09:19 AM
#13
Had another track weekend - a 3 day event this time. Brakes performed flawlessly.
Normally I would bleed the brakes somewhere in the middle, but with the AMSOIL DOT4 brake fluid, I have not had the need to bleed excessively. That's a real time saver! I'm not sure if it takes on less moisture or what.
I really feel the AMSOIL DOT4 brake fluid gives me a stiffer pedal than the Motul that I used to use. Because of that, I find it easier to modulate towards threshold braking and not use ABS. That might sound weird, but it's resulted in much smoother braking zones on the track, less tire scrubbing and ultimately better corner speeds and lower overall times. A good setup makes the driver confident and that confidence allows you to push the car harder.
Thanks again for turning me onto a great product!
Normally I would bleed the brakes somewhere in the middle, but with the AMSOIL DOT4 brake fluid, I have not had the need to bleed excessively. That's a real time saver! I'm not sure if it takes on less moisture or what.
I really feel the AMSOIL DOT4 brake fluid gives me a stiffer pedal than the Motul that I used to use. Because of that, I find it easier to modulate towards threshold braking and not use ABS. That might sound weird, but it's resulted in much smoother braking zones on the track, less tire scrubbing and ultimately better corner speeds and lower overall times. A good setup makes the driver confident and that confidence allows you to push the car harder.
Thanks again for turning me onto a great product!
Sep 8, 2009, 01:53 PM
#14
Great review! I run the same fluid, but you're DEF pushing the car harder then I ever will...at least at this point in it's life!
Any recommendations in regards to a good street pad set up? Something that'll stop you when you need it to no matter what.
-Jalal
Any recommendations in regards to a good street pad set up? Something that'll stop you when you need it to no matter what.
-Jalal
Sep 8, 2009, 02:09 PM
#15
Before I went to a track dedicated pad, I ran PF Z pads which are Performance Friction Z rated pads. I liked them. I actually used them for both DD, and DE events when I was first starting. They didn't squeal at all, and fading wasn't bad (I was running upgraded fluid already). That's all I've used.
I moved onto track-only pads after those...