GT3076R - Internal WG Failure

[Hiboost]

So I've got my car prepped as well as it can be for a 2 day HPDE at Watkins Glen and the first session out I just finish a warmup lap and get into about 25 psi of boost which is lower than I normally run on the street. Out of nowhere I see a splash of oil coming out of my passenger hood vent and start splattering the windshield. Sigh...

So I make my way back to the pits after seeing no smoke behind the car and no corner workers black flagging me for fluids and pray it's something stupid like the oil dipstick popping up. Sure enough, the stupid dipstick was raised a few inches and there was a nice coating of oil over everything. After cleanup it appeared I only lost less than an 1/8 of a quart and I noticed the dipstick would only lock 90% of the time so last time I checked it right before hitting the track I must not have pulled up on it slightly to verify it had any resistance.

Fast forward through 6 more sessions of hitting up to 145-150 mph on the backstretch on the new GT30 turbo versus 130-135 mph on the stock turbo and it was clear there was more power on tap but I eventually learned to drive it smoothly and was ripping around the track considering I was only on street tires. All was good until the 2nd to last session on day 2 and then I noticed the boost suddenly dropped from 25 psi in 5th down to 20 psi with power dropping off as I climbed the esses. I was literally half a lap from slowing down anyways since there was only 5 minutes left so I nursed it back to the pits with no other obvious signs of problems.

I checked what I could and after seeing no obvious problems I decided to call it a day and head home a little early. When the WG was still allowing 20 psi at higher RPM's everything seemed snug but I could literally hear something rattling around in my exhaust and only speculate it was either the WG flapper or pieces of the exhaust turbine. By the time I got home the turbo would barely boost past 5 psi and the exhaust tone got louder and louder. After checking things out this morning when it was all cooled off I could pull the WG flapper out from the turbo like there was no longer a flapper attached at all so likely it has completely failed and bounced down my exhaust.

Since I've heard of this failure occur to others I'm wondering if a completely missing WG flapper would bypass enough to only allow 2-3 psi as that is all I can muster right now. I plan on checking the turbo from the intake side tonight but taking off the Downpipe is more of a pain to check the exhaust turbine. I just don't want to assume that the WG is the only issue. Do I really go through an 8 hr + removal and installation to get a new GT30 turbo only to risk having the same issue again in the future? What happens when it's out of warranty?

I'm considering that ATP transformable DP setup (~$760) and just tapping and plugging the internal WG hole with a bolt (or welding it) to just avoid the potential issue in the future. Unless they have changed the design it just seems like it would eventually fail again.

[Boostd4]

This sucks man...you seemed to be having really good luck with this turbo.

I won't name names but there is a documented "issue" that someone ran into that was much more catastrophic than this...

[Hiboost]

Originally Posted by Boostd4

This sucks man...you seemed to be having really good luck with this turbo.

I won't name names but there is a documented "issue" that someone ran into that was much more catastrophic than this...

Indeed, honestly It was running like a champ until recently when I started smelling a small exhaust leak that slightly effected spool. This told me it was a leak in the headers or the turbo itself.

Until I really tear into the car I won't know if it's "just" the internal WG or the exhaust turbine/cracked exhaust housing etc. Please PM me with more details if you think it will help me verify what has failed with my setup. I was smelling an exhaust leak that for the life of me I could not locate on the ETS headers so it's very possible it was through the WG flapper mounting hole OR worse somewhere in the exhaust side of the turbine itself, which is wrapped with the DEI Titanium turbo wrap and not easily accessible.

[t12ung]

Wow you were like one of the very few that had a good experience with this turbo and now this? I wonder why Garrett would do such a thing like releasing this turbo with out thorough r&d.

[migs647]

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[ETS Michael]

Man this suck!! looks like everything was going good!



In the past we have seen setups like this leak between the wastegate and the exhaust due to the extra back pressure (This leak is hard to hear). We have seen the stock setup leaks with no added back pressure. If i remember correctly, ATP does not include a gasket either (unless things have changed)

Good Luck Man!

Thanks,

Michael

[linjy2]

o wow subscribed for update.

[Hiboost]

Originally Posted by ETS Michael

Man this suck!! looks like everything was going good!



In the past we have seen setups like this leak between the wastegate and the exhaust due to the extra back pressure (This leak is hard to hear). We have seen the stock setup leaks with no added back pressure. If i remember correctly, ATP does not include a gasket either (unless things have changed)

Good Luck Man!

Thanks,

Michael

Ahhh, good point Michael. Could you guys alter your current O2 DP to mount a 38mm tial external WG setup as well that also has a proper gasket? Likely I'll swap the entire turbo and look into converting to an external wastgate setup down the road but doing it now while I'll have it all apart would be smart too.

[palmerblock]

Originally Posted by Hiboost

Ahhh, good point Michael. Could you guys alter your current O2 DP to mount a 38mm tial external WG setup as well that also has a proper gasket? Likely I'll swap the entire turbo and look into converting to an external wastgate setup down the road but doing it now while I'll have it all apart would be smart too.

i run my fpred and ultimate racing divorced o2 housing with no gasket, with no issues and zero leaks...

you dont need one if the surfaces are machined flat and the bolts are torqued...

[newcomer81]

subscribed.
at least your wg flapper failed open instead of closed =/

[MR. Tim]

Sorry to hear Chris. With the success you had it is a shame something like this would happen.

[SiC]

Originally Posted by palmerblock

you dont need one if the surfaces are machined flat and the bolts are torqued...

If that were true, then there would be no requirements for any exhaust gaskets since most exhaust flanges are all machined flat. I'm not challenging you, it's just hard for me to believe this.

[Hiboost]

Originally Posted by newcomer81

subscribed.
at least your wg flapper failed open instead of closed =/

Well yes and no.

Depends on what is more painfull, having to manually modulate boost using the throttle making sure to keep it under 25 psi and still moving at a decent pace.

OR

Putting the foot to the floor and get maybe 2-3 psi and crying when you can barely maintain 75 mph up a hill. Honestly driving the car with zero boost has to be one of the most painfull things I've ever had to do, it just feels so violated.

I'm still having a hard time believing that with the Wastgate flapper completely gone there is so much exhaust pressure bypassed that I can only get a few psi of boost. Has anyone else had a similar experience and verify that it's possible? I'll find out more this weekend when I inspect the turbo from the intake and exhaust sides.

I'm working with RavSpec to arrange a warranty exchange with Garrett, hopefully I can have all the parts lined up for open heart surgery the following weekend.

[Hiboost]

So not much has happened since the last update, RavSpec had a busy weekend and then checked to see what GT3076R turbos were available. Apparently they couldn't find any at this time so I'm not really sure what is supposed to happen next.

I wanted to check if the rest of my turbo was ok besides the WG last night but had to work til 9pm and the car was too hot to mess with late at night. I'm starting to get pissed off how slow this pile of crap is without boost, we're talking 0-60 in 12 seconds pissed off.

I'll verify the turbo is otherwise spinning properly tonight and decide from there if I'll just convert to an external setup and not try and replace the entire turbo. Honestly if I knew how difficult it was going to be to get parts for this turbo "kit" I would never have gone with it. First the Oil Feed banjo bolt was impossible to source and now getting the turbo itself is like hens teeth to resolve the WG flapper shearing off.

Is there any kind of direct number to Garrett that I can contact someone up the chain besides a distributor? There is a local Garrett distributor in Rochester but they are more of a diesel specialist, although I usually find showing up in person gets things done more effectively at times. I honestly want to talk to someone in charge of the marketing and distribution of these GT30 turbo kits so that they don't ever follow the same path again, they really should be embarrassed.

[GST Motorsports]

Boostd4 is right, you are lucky the turbo didn't just blow up and rip the downpipe to shreads from the turbine wheel flying through it.

This happened on our dyno with the ATP Turbo test Evo 10 at 7000rpm. It made a cool spyhunter scene though. If the car had a straight pipe the turbine wheel probably would have shot across the parking lot

The WG flapper failing has happened to a couple tracked 10's now. It probably cannot withstand the heat. Some have bent the actual arm as well.

Garrett makes good turbos, unfortunatly this is not one of them imho. There is a reason why you didn't see many reviews or dynosheets on this turbo.

Fortunatly for us, there are Dom 2's, FPreds and even a BBK soon available for the Evo 10.

- Bryan