Wider track or wider tires ?

zbomb · Feb 25, 2009, 11:27 AM

Hi All

Looking at some specs of top dog Japan TA Evo's, Namely the HKS CT230R and the Cyber Evo I became struck by curiousity. I'm going to be doing some speculation here as specs on these cars are a little hard to come by.

From what I have found both car's run a 265 tire, kind of skinny for the massive cornering speeds their generating.

They do both use methods of widening the track. I know the cyber Evo uses at least custom control arms and I suspect the HKS car does as well.

Something I found interesting from the HKS car is they use a massive spacer as well.

Some more pics and info on HKS car here

I'm basically looking for any technical info as to why both of these car's run on what I feel to be skinny tires and seem to make up the extra space under huge wide fenders with spacing. Both of these car's must have room to run big rubber. Maybe Japanese TA regs ?

EVO Adjustable Front Control Arm Options

V.8MR · Feb 25, 2009, 11:32 AM

Probably both.

nils · Feb 25, 2009, 11:40 AM

prolly modified the suspension geometry a bunch on those cars....

265 is considered the 'appropriate' size tire for those cars by the japanese.... this is why I only run 265's on my car too (could prolly fit 285's).

so many ways to go fast....

zbomb · Feb 25, 2009, 12:06 PM

I hear you Nils...But you run stock...or kinda stock fenders. Both of these car's easily have room for as big a tire as they want. But a freakin 1" spacer. I would not have think the fastest TA car would use such a stop gap type of part. Maybe they have a bunch of different sizes to tune it.

Definate geometry changes going on. The HKS car has the drivetrain tunnel raised so they could hike up the components and maintain ground clearance...Sick...Read the link in my OP.

SME · Feb 25, 2009, 12:16 PM

Wow thats a huge spacer

Bggstin · Feb 25, 2009, 12:23 PM

You can also see that the geometry was changed in the picture with the top of the coilover that was in the link provided. The entire top of the strut tower has been cut and rewelded.

Evolution IVGSR · Feb 25, 2009, 12:43 PM

Its all the suspension and driver

lol I think they have the wider body to run a wide wheel and have the spacer to widen there stance for better cornering. + there cars are are lower than most and very light weight. The wider wheels with a Race tire 265 stretches the tire a little bit which makes the tires side wall stronger and harder.

We notice a big difference in performance, handling and times when we change up a friends Time Attack car from 285 to 265 tires. on a 10.5" wide wheel. the 285 bulged a bit on the wheel and the 265 where slightly stretched and had a stiffer side wall then. He also got a much lower offset wheel on his car since he was wide body which widens the stance of the car too.

nils · Feb 25, 2009, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zbomb

I hear you Nils...But you run stock...or kinda stock fenders. Both of these car's easily have room for as big a tire as they want. But a freakin 1" spacer. I would not have think the fastest TA car would use such a stop gap type of part. Maybe they have a bunch of different sizes to tune it.

Definate geometry changes going on. The HKS car has the drivetrain tunnel raised so they could hike up the components and maintain ground clearance...Sick...Read the link in my OP.

dont be scurred of spacers....

like i said... I think its more of a mentality thing than a physical thing... according to Japanese tuner culture, 265 is the proper tire to fit on an evo.

besides they run ridiculous compounds in those 265 series tires... when the hks evo was a superlap battle they blistered their tires in 1-3 laps... lol

zbomb · Feb 25, 2009, 07:59 PM

Valid points N. Cyber Evo 1.42 @ Fuji. Not scared enough of spacers to not run them...soon.

I think the HKS car ran a 10" wide wheel, not 100% of the Cyber but I think it's a 10.5

AlwaysinBoost · Feb 26, 2009, 06:26 AM

What surprises me is that they're using a BOLT-ON spacer rather then a slip-on spacer.

I thought the safest way to run a spacer was with longer studs and using a spacer that gets sandwiched between the wheel and the hub. Not bolting a spacer to the hub, then bolting the wheel to that.

Bggstin · Feb 26, 2009, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlwaysinBoost

What surprises me is that they're using a BOLT-ON spacer rather then a slip-on spacer.

I thought the safest way to run a spacer was with longer studs and using a spacer that gets sandwiched between the wheel and the hub. Not bolting a spacer to the hub, then bolting the wheel to that.

I don't think thats an issue really. With the spacer bolted to the hub and the wheel bolted to the spacer, I would say it's safer than sandwiching them. Bolting them together would lessen the force the bolt see's where it's bolted versus running one long stud through them all.

**Fireball** · Feb 26, 2009, 08:57 AM

I currently run a 1/2" spacer on the front (ONLY) of my car, using ARP wheel studs.

Works great, I have a 1" wider track in the front, plus using 255 sized tires. By not changing the rear, I induce a lot of front grip and seem to dramatically eliminate the understeer common in the Evo.

Looks pretty wicked when you look down the side of the car too...the fronts stick out noticeably further.

V.8MR · Feb 26, 2009, 10:11 AM

It sure does. Im running a 10m spacer and 1 inch wider wheels in the front.

**Fireball** · Feb 26, 2009, 12:56 PM

Uhh, think you're missin something there!

GTLocke13 · Feb 26, 2009, 01:20 PM

Yeah, Nils definitely hit on the Japanese mentality here. They're completely missing the "bigger is better" thing that we have going on here in America. If I was putting a widebody kit on, I'd have 335's under the thing.

And bolt-on spacers put less stress on the lugs. A slip-on spacer that big would scare me.