View Poll Results: FP Red or BBK
FP Red
193
47.89%
BBK
182
45.16%
Other turbo, please specify
28
6.95%
Voters: 403. You may not vote on this poll
POLL: FP Red or BBK
Nov 24, 2009, 10:50 AM
#31
400-450 whp i say
HTA Green
FP red
Tomei Arms
BBK Full
All those will get you that powerlevel its all about spool rate and top end from this point. if you want room to grow its all about the fp red if you just want fast spool then hta green or bbk full for sure. the tomei seem in between. at this point does not really matter what you choose if you dont have the right mix of mods then your not going to put down what you want. you list looks good i agree with everybody else and say upper your cam selection. also i would run 1000cc injectors. other then that port everything out and just pick one of those and you will get your goal easy but just remember the red can get you ALOT MORE power when your ready for it
HTA Green
FP red
Tomei Arms
BBK Full
All those will get you that powerlevel its all about spool rate and top end from this point. if you want room to grow its all about the fp red if you just want fast spool then hta green or bbk full for sure. the tomei seem in between. at this point does not really matter what you choose if you dont have the right mix of mods then your not going to put down what you want. you list looks good i agree with everybody else and say upper your cam selection. also i would run 1000cc injectors. other then that port everything out and just pick one of those and you will get your goal easy but just remember the red can get you ALOT MORE power when your ready for it
Nov 24, 2009, 02:12 PM
#32
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Okay Mr. I know everything! If you actually read what I posted you would realize that I am talking about torque not HP! Maybe you should ask Junior about that since HE was the one of the tuners that told me that torque is what causes internals to sh&t the bed . I guess since your tune is so special you have nothing to worry about...
p.s. If you look at your tune your not really close to the threshold so your "tune" is isn't aggressive enough to be concerned. Hp number don't mean much...
p.s. If you look at your tune your not really close to the threshold so your "tune" is isn't aggressive enough to be concerned. Hp number don't mean much...
. Junior rarely tunes a 4 banger over 450ft lbs. With the exemption of the race STi.
Nov 24, 2009, 03:37 PM
#34
Nobody truly knows what the limits of our block is, we can only guess and take an estimate... but some have came to the conclusion that 450wtq is the magic number...
as for the OP, what are your true goals with the car..? Daily driven street terror, drag, road course, auto-x... the later two I would stay away from the FP Red...
good luck on your search...
as for the OP, what are your true goals with the car..? Daily driven street terror, drag, road course, auto-x... the later two I would stay away from the FP Red...
good luck on your search...
i would like a low 11's or faster, full weight, pump gas street car. after turbo upgrade i WILL be getting a daily driver, but this will be more or less a weekend car. it will be set up for road course with occansional auto-x and drag. i am leaning more towards the red mainly because of the fact if i did meth, e85, c16, etc it's going to give me more power than the others. like people said, theres room to grow with the red.
hey man
I have similar power goals/mods/mod plans as you.. I think the only diff is I don't have UICP. I'm making roughly 370-380whp, and I'm looking for a final goal of around 450whp, probably a little less. I believe our motors are good up to 500whp (at an upper limit) and the weak point are the rod bolts.
I voted BBK, just because I hear really good things about the turbo in terms of the quality, spool, and power it makes. It works great on pump gas 93 (I also plan to run nothing but 93.. no e85, meth anything like that). I have GSC S1's, which are like 264/268 i believe, and stock valve springs, so pretty similar in terms of cams. I probably won't upgrade to S2's. Turbo alone won't get you up to that power level, but I'm thinking of getting the AMS FI intake and some sort of tubular manifold as well, and then retuning etc. That'll probably put me around maybe like 420 to the wheels or so, and I don't plan on doing anything other than that.
I have similar power goals/mods/mod plans as you.. I think the only diff is I don't have UICP. I'm making roughly 370-380whp, and I'm looking for a final goal of around 450whp, probably a little less. I believe our motors are good up to 500whp (at an upper limit) and the weak point are the rod bolts.
I voted BBK, just because I hear really good things about the turbo in terms of the quality, spool, and power it makes. It works great on pump gas 93 (I also plan to run nothing but 93.. no e85, meth anything like that). I have GSC S1's, which are like 264/268 i believe, and stock valve springs, so pretty similar in terms of cams. I probably won't upgrade to S2's. Turbo alone won't get you up to that power level, but I'm thinking of getting the AMS FI intake and some sort of tubular manifold as well, and then retuning etc. That'll probably put me around maybe like 420 to the wheels or so, and I don't plan on doing anything other than that.
greddy 264's are a 10.8 intake and 10.3 exhaust lift i believe, which is close to most 272's if not higher. i am toying with the idea of GSC S1's or the FP 4R cams w/springs and retainers. i will most likely stick with the greddy cams for now and see how much power they make. they seem like decent torque cams and i figure the 25psi wastegate will hold boost up top along with the red. i am going with either the Full Race, JM Fab or Shearer manifold along with the Shearer O2 dump
as for spool on the red, if its only 400rpm later, then i guess i couldn't mind it TOO much, although right now i hit peak boost/torque at right around 3500rpm according to my 4th gear pull dyno sheets
Nov 24, 2009, 04:03 PM
#35
Evolving Member
See my results in teh dyno section to back that up.
.
Nov 24, 2009, 04:08 PM
#36
i would like a low 11's or faster, full weight, pump gas street car. after turbo upgrade i WILL be getting a daily driver, but this will be more or less a weekend car. it will be set up for road course with occansional auto-x and drag. i am leaning more towards the red mainly because of the fact if i did meth, e85, c16, etc it's going to give me more power than the others. like people said, theres room to grow with the red.
greddy 264's are a 10.8 intake and 10.3 exhaust lift i believe, which is close to most 272's if not higher. i am toying with the idea of GSC S1's or the FP 4R cams w/springs and retainers. i will most likely stick with the greddy cams for now and see how much power they make. they seem like decent torque cams and i figure the 25psi wastegate will hold boost up top along with the red. i am going with either the Full Race, JM Fab or Shearer manifold along with the Shearer O2 dump
as for spool on the red, if its only 400rpm later, then i guess i couldn't mind it TOO much, although right now i hit peak boost/torque at right around 3500rpm according to my 4th gear pull dyno sheets
greddy 264's are a 10.8 intake and 10.3 exhaust lift i believe, which is close to most 272's if not higher. i am toying with the idea of GSC S1's or the FP 4R cams w/springs and retainers. i will most likely stick with the greddy cams for now and see how much power they make. they seem like decent torque cams and i figure the 25psi wastegate will hold boost up top along with the red. i am going with either the Full Race, JM Fab or Shearer manifold along with the Shearer O2 dump
as for spool on the red, if its only 400rpm later, then i guess i couldn't mind it TOO much, although right now i hit peak boost/torque at right around 3500rpm according to my 4th gear pull dyno sheets
Nov 24, 2009, 04:08 PM
#37
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why not go with the new black...it is almost the same price as the red. I paid $2k for the black, 25psi wastegate actuator, port job, and the FP upgraded oil line. And with the black, 450whp on a mustang dyno is no problem and you dont loose much in spool. I hit full spool on my 2.0l and FP black at 3780rpms.
Nov 24, 2009, 04:09 PM
#38
First off the Red and the BBK were designed by two different people with two different thoughts in mind. On pump 93 I would go Red otherwise you won't reach your hp goal. The BBK-XL or B or wtf ever Chad is going to call it still won't make 480whp on pump!
Also you will not get 450tq out of either turbo unless you run crazy boost 30+psi, which you can't on pump, and your motor will not like that to much. On a Red 480hp will be around 360-390tq. That is perfect imo and your motor will last you forever. I have seen 600hp cars with 380tq NEVER pop a rod and they have all had over 50k miles. I think that 425tq would still be safe but 450tq is the line that no one on stock block should ever attempt to cross!
Mikey
Also you will not get 450tq out of either turbo unless you run crazy boost 30+psi, which you can't on pump, and your motor will not like that to much. On a Red 480hp will be around 360-390tq. That is perfect imo and your motor will last you forever. I have seen 600hp cars with 380tq NEVER pop a rod and they have all had over 50k miles. I think that 425tq would still be safe but 450tq is the line that no one on stock block should ever attempt to cross!
Mikey
Nov 24, 2009, 04:11 PM
#39
why not go with the new black...it is almost the same price as the red. I paid $2k for the black, 25psi wastegate actuator, port job, and the FP upgraded oil line. And with the black, 450whp on a mustang dyno is no problem and you dont loose much in spool. I hit full spool on my 2.0l and FP black at 3780rpms.
vs. Yonkers PD people 
Nov 24, 2009, 06:51 PM
#43
This is why we are better! YOU WILL LEARN...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03FQngxD33k
CONTINUED HERE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siL_G...eature=channel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03FQngxD33k
CONTINUED HERE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siL_G...eature=channel
Last edited by EriCS; Nov 24, 2009 at 06:56 PM.
Nov 25, 2009, 04:35 AM
#44
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greddy 264's are a 10.8 intake and 10.3 exhaust lift i believe, which is close to most 272's if not higher. i am toying with the idea of GSC S1's or the FP 4R cams w/springs and retainers. i will most likely stick with the greddy cams for now and see how much power they make. they seem like decent torque cams and i figure the 25psi wastegate will hold boost up top along with the red. i am going with either the Full Race, JM Fab or Shearer manifold along with the Shearer O2 dump
as for spool on the red, if its only 400rpm later, then i guess i couldn't mind it TOO much, although right now i hit peak boost/torque at right around 3500rpm according to my 4th gear pull dyno sheets
as for spool on the red, if its only 400rpm later, then i guess i couldn't mind it TOO much, although right now i hit peak boost/torque at right around 3500rpm according to my 4th gear pull dyno sheets
Nov 25, 2009, 07:10 AM
#45
First off the Red and the BBK were designed by two different people with two different thoughts in mind. On pump 93 I would go Red otherwise you won't reach your hp goal. The BBK-XL or B or wtf ever Chad is going to call it still won't make 480whp on pump!
Also you will not get 450tq out of either turbo unless you run crazy boost 30+psi, which you can't on pump, and your motor will not like that to much. On a Red 480hp will be around 360-390tq. That is perfect imo and your motor will last you forever. I have seen 600hp cars with 380tq NEVER pop a rod and they have all had over 50k miles. I think that 425tq would still be safe but 450tq is the line that no one on stock block should ever attempt to cross!
Mikey
Also you will not get 450tq out of either turbo unless you run crazy boost 30+psi, which you can't on pump, and your motor will not like that to much. On a Red 480hp will be around 360-390tq. That is perfect imo and your motor will last you forever. I have seen 600hp cars with 380tq NEVER pop a rod and they have all had over 50k miles. I think that 425tq would still be safe but 450tq is the line that no one on stock block should ever attempt to cross!
Mikey
Mikey,
on what dyno? we have had bbk's make 450-480 on DJ's....380-430on our dyno on pump, unfortunately alot of our clients never post (seeing as we have over 250 of them out worldwide I'd say very few were posted). that being said, we've never had a red make more than 420whp on pump here either...
The larger turbo will obviously make more power..... the final version will be tested shortly.
regardless,
I feel the stock block on our dyno is good and reliable to say 430whp with a good tune, much more i think youll be seeing a rod or piston in your future
cb