Full Blown Dual Pump System - Things You Should Know

[1slowlaser]

I have first hand experience with E85. I run FIC1450s, one walbro 255 intank (hp), one bosch 044 inline (after the fuel filter, before the fuel rail), with a fuelab afpr. I made 650whp on this combo and straight E85 with voltage dropping to 12.2V under boost, not an ideal situation. IDC's did peak at 106% IDC's with 32psi of boost, at a 38psi base fuel pressure. I can guarantee this combo, with base fuel pressure set too 45psi and voltage that can sustain 13.3V under boost will power 700whp worth of ethanol. I can almost guarantee 750-800whp w/a single boost-a-pump on just the bosch 044 working at 17+ volts on ethanol. I for one will be seeing how far I can push this system, my goal is 750whp. FWIW, the pumps are wired in series, also no re-wire done to the pumps as well.

[hks-gst]

I was recently working on a Full Blown setup for my 2g dsm (very similler to evo) and now Full Blown includes there own brass siphon "T" the return hole seems alittle big has anyone tried the Full blown brass setup?


Here are some pics of the Full blown Tee compared to stock.

[Drifto]

Originally Posted by hks-gst

I was recently working on a Full Blown setup for my 2g dsm (very similler to evo) and now Full Blown includes there own brass siphon "T" the return hole seems alittle big has anyone tried the Full blown brass setup?


Here are some pics of the Full blown Tee compared to stock.

You may want to alter the clamp position in this pic!!

I found that putting the clamp that holds the pumps in that position can have a serious detriment to pump output. So much infact that it can completely stop the pump ability to pump or prime. I found that moving the clamp up to the middle of the pumps, just under the fuel level sending unit, allows you to actually tighten the clamp without fear of distorting the pump body and ruining its ability to pump. I came to this conclusion after installing the set up in an Evo about a week ago. The new pump just happend to be the one that was the primary. Because of this it was "dry" inside and combined with the low placement of the tightened clamp, which apparently distorted the pump body enough to open up internal clearances, the pump would not prime. I removed the assembly, put it on the bench and began to test it with a 12v source. I found that almost ANY pressure from the clamp in that lower pump region would impede pumping. The more I tightened it the less puh, puh, puh(pumping sounds) I would hear until nothing but motor whirring. When I move the clamp up to the mid-pump position I was able to tighten the clamp and there was no loss of pumping action.

[l2r99gst]

That's good info. When I saw this design way back when, I never liked the clamp for the pumps. They went through CNC'ing a nice housing...why not finish it off with a nice attachment on the bottom for the pumps to rest in.

[rodent]

On the Evo, I believe there's more outer holes you don't see inside the siphon tube. I believe this is what helps the siphon. Just blow through it to see what I mean. It looks like it only flows through that small hole but think there's more too it. The return line is much easier to blow through than the line that goes to the other tank.

Like someone had mentioned, a larger brass T fitting that didn't work for him. Does Full Blown do anything special to the T to make it siphon correctly?

[hks-gst]

Originally Posted by rodent

Like someone had mentioned, a larger brass T fitting that didn't work for him. Does Full Blown do anything special to the T to make it siphon correctly?

I havent opend it up to see what they do. I just spoke to somebody running the F.B T fitting and they said it worked for them and siphoned good Unfortunatly Full blown is extremely hard to deal with not only did I have to wait along time for my hanger setup but they are also impossible to get a hold of and get some questions answerd

[E85evo8]

going to be trying this on my full blown twin pump setup as well....hopefully it will fix/lower my idle FP as well

[I am Jack's DSM]

Originally Posted by Ted B

When I elected to go with a LARGE turbo and considered the prospect of running E85, I knew that one 255 lph pump would be insufficient, and so like several others, I opted for Full Blown's tidy dual pump system. When we installed the system, I had Drifto (www.mpfab.com) upgrade my fuel lines to AN-8 feed and AN-6 return, and we swapped in an aftermarket fuel rail so I could use a liquid-filled FP gauge and adjustable FPR.

I haven't read through this, so excuse me if it's been posted already.

Liquid filled fuel pressure gauges are sh*t. They give inaccurate readings because the liquid inside the gauge heats up. My base pressure would fluctuate and I never seemed to be able to figure it out. Ditched the liquid filled gauge and my base pressure readings were solid and repeatable.

It's a cheap test. I recommend it.

[E85evo8]

just did this modification and it worked perfectly!! FP is down to 43-44psi at idle and my a/f now have steady'd and idle is awesome!! thanks to Ted for this posting/info!!!!

[big block dsm]

Originally Posted by Ted B

You can identify your pump from the part number. FWIW, all turbo cars use HP pumps, so if you bought yours from a familiar vendor, the chances are small that they'd have sold you the incorrect one.

You'd have to ask Drifto about the wiring, but the new, beefier wiring harness at the pumps would look familiar to you if you saw it. Think lighting harness for a trailer.

There is no reason to have the plastic 'T' fitting made, as modding the factory one takes all of about 10 seconds once you remove it.

there are some shops saleing the reg pump, when u order ask them what pump u are getting. i remove a reg pump from a friends evo not even a week ago and it was from a big name shop. when he called about the pump they told him, he need to ask for the 255 hp pump.

[WHTEVO]

That tee might work but i can almost guarantee it will not. We tried to make one for a experimental fuel setup and one of the tees was almost the same as that, and it would not work. Even after trying several different size orifice sizes. You may want to spend the time and try and duplicate fuel going through it outside of the tank to make sure. The line dumping into the tank needs to be much smaller then the inlet of that tee. It doesn't look to be that way in the pic. Good luck.

Aaron

[big block dsm]

Originally Posted by fostytou

I'm not totally familiar with that product, but it looks similar to the hobbs solution... just adding a bit more voltage to get more out of the pumps. The problem here is that it is very difficult to tune for something like this. It is very possible that in one gear/rpm/etc combination you are at 80 load and in another you are at 120 load.

The question is how do you tune for the extra fuel when you don't know when it will start flowing (based on your tunable parameters)?

here is a link

http://www.kennebell.net/accessories...boostapump.htm

[E85evo8]

Thanks again Ted B!! This modification has smoothed out/gotten rid of all the little "hiccups" etc. that I was plagued with due to such high fuel pressure during idle, cruise, etc.

[rodent]

Update on my setup- its working great! The twin return lines are not causing any issues. Already been through 3 tanks of E85 and no problems from full to empty. Working just like factory. I'm going to throw an E85 analyzer on one of the return lines.