Db Values..

[Waz996]

In my limited quest for tuning my audio system, I've just a simple question:

My rear speakers (Kenwood 6.5in KFC-P708) are component type.. The cross-over box has three settings for the tweeter: 0db/-2db/-4db

I would just like to know what the values are:

Do these settings attenuate the power to the tweeters, 0db being no resistance and -4db being a higher attenuation? Or the opposite?

Thanks for all replies!

Wael

[Blast83]

-db settings would lower the sound of them. Although 0,-2,-4 wouldn't really have a noticeable distinction between them for the human ear. I see things like this on home surround sounds. I have an analog input that has settings from -12db to 0. This is for when the sound output is a lot louder than other components and you want to keep them at the same relative level w/o having to adjust the volume depending on what you're using. Your settings would just lower how loud it is if was louder than your speakers, I would assume.

[stretch15]

that would be your selectable tweeter level on your passive crossovers sir. how you use those levels will be determined by the positioning and alignment of your tweeters in your car. depending on the level that you choose, the resulting sound will either be smooth/focused/balanced or harsh.

[Waz996]

Ok, i get you, lots of info and all i want to do is listen to my techno! :-)

.. But what would be the smooth setting, '0' or '-4'? Because I tried having each on a different setting, and Blast83 is right that it's so hard to discern the difference!

Thanks

[biggie5252]

The negative number will make the tweeters less loud in relation to the mids (-4 being the quietest). -4 would very generally be regarded as the "smoothest", but like said above it depends greatly on location, aiming, etc. For example, if your tweeters were mounted in the dash, most people would find the 0 setting quite harsh and bright and you would select -2 or -4 to "smooth" it out. If they're mounted in the doors/kickpanels then a negative setting may not be loud enough and you would use the 0 setting.

With them being mounted in the rear deck, it is very likely you won't hear a difference between settings. You could try fading to only rears and setting it that way, or try listening from the rear seat.

How much power are you running to your component set? Any equalizers involved?

[Waz996]

Ok Thanks Biggie..

I've got the following setup:

- Front Alpine V12 Amp powering Alpine TR6 components
- Rear Alpine (200W) powering Kenwoods P708 components located behind the headrests
- Mono Amp (800W Pioneer) powering 12inch JL Sub enclosed in the boot

I made sure the back Kenwood tweeters are set without the headrests being on the way. So I suppose I'll just set them mid-way at -2dB..

Otherwise, I'm fading the rear speakers much to keep a rather front biased listening output.. I'm having trouble that the Kenwood cones are vibrating so much (farting!), maybe it's because they're not enclosed in a small volume?

Wael

[stretch15]

+1 on what biggie mentioned, especially with these components mounted in the rear deck. i would assume then that your tweeter is mounted really close to the midbass woofer which could be why the tweeter levels don't sound as distinct. imho, you'll be better off with just fading to the front for a better front soundstage, just as what you have mentioned. your rear speakers will then be just for ambience or for additional rear fills. as much as possible, you would like to have a defined front soundstage, just as how you would listen to a live recording or concert.

as for the kenwood midbass woofers, you might want to check your crossover settings for those, as well. it's possible that those drivers are playing too low already based on the hpf setting, either in your amp or head unit.

[Waz996]

Got that stretch! Nice to hear you're confirming what I'm actually doing! It's the 'concert effect' I'm trying to listen to eventually..

Only I have to figure out how to fade the rear midbass woofers, since there is no independent control for those,,, and fading them too much will fade the rear tweeters which are really nice to have as a surround effect!

I also feel the need for more bass! This 12inch seems not to be enough now!

This is addictive!

Wael

[prodigalsunn]

what kind of 12in jl do you have?? no enough bass, maybe you should upgrade to the 12w7 or 13w7 and a larger amp

[stretch15]

Originally Posted by Waz996

Got that stretch! Nice to hear you're confirming what I'm actually doing! It's the 'concert effect' I'm trying to listen to eventually..

Only I have to figure out how to fade the rear midbass woofers, since there is no independent control for those,,, and fading them too much will fade the rear tweeters which are really nice to have as a surround effect!

I also feel the need for more bass! This 12inch seems not to be enough now!

This is addictive!

Wael

+1 on the addictive part

yup, having a well defined front soundstage will give the 'concert' effect you want. if you really want to have ambient sounds from your rear tweeters, you'll probably want to set your tweeter level on the passive xovers to 0db and probably cut them higher on the high pass filter than the ones set for your front components. another thing you can look into is probably cutting the high pass filter for your front components a bit lower for more midbass to help out your sub, as long as they can handle it. if it starts clipping, pull it back.

as for your bass, before ditching your 12in sub, you can still look into tuning options, too. gain and xover settings can be adjusted for this, with a little equalization on the sub bass frequencies.

[Waz996]

Thanks again guys!

I dont know which JBL 12inch I got.. But I am willing to look into an upgrade should the bass improve with a better brand/model..

The head does allow a subwoofer output level but even maxed out, i feel there is need for more.. If i fiddle around with the equalizer, the speakers will be affected and probably fail to respond more..

THe head also has crossover settings but I really dont have an idea how this works! It's factory setting as for now..

I guess I need to learn more..

Wael

[stretch15]

Originally Posted by Waz996

Thanks again guys!

I dont know which JBL 12inch I got.. But I am willing to look into an upgrade should the bass improve with a better brand/model..

The head does allow a subwoofer output level but even maxed out, i feel there is need for more.. If i fiddle around with the equalizer, the speakers will be affected and probably fail to respond more..

THe head also has crossover settings but I really dont have an idea how this works! It's factory setting as for now..

I guess I need to learn more..

Wael

you can check on the gains set on your subwoofer amp but just keep in mind that the gain control does not equate to a volume control. that way you're only adjusting for the sub bass frequencies and your component speakers won't be affected. another thing you can look into is your enclosure and the specs of your sub. there will be a significant difference in sound output if your sub is in a ported/vented or sealed enclosure.

the crossover settings are designed to control the frequencies sent and played by your speakers...high pass filters are for your midbass/midrange/tweets, represented by your component speakers whereas the low pass filter is for your sub. if these filters are turned off, your speakers are engaged in full-range mode, which means no filtering of frequencies. for example, an hpf setting of 80 for your front components means that they will play frequencies not lower than 80 while and lpf setting of 60 will allow your sub to play frequencies up to 60 only. indeed there are lots of tuning options in the audio world. try out the settings to see what suits your musical preferences best coz in the end, your ears are still the best judge. happy tuning!