How-To: Warm/Hot Starts (and cold ones) with E85 - Page 3

GST Motorsports · Aug 6, 2009, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travman

I have taken fuel out in increments down to zero and it doesn't change anything.....

Yea I understand that. If it starts better on E85, and E85 needs more fuel for starting than 93, it leads me to believe it's getting too much fuel on 93.

Will it start right up if you have the accel pedal to the floor? (shutting off the injectors)

travman · Aug 6, 2009, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GST Motorsports

Yea I understand that. If it starts better on E85, and E85 needs more fuel for starting than 93, it leads me to believe it's getting too much fuel on 93.

Will it start right up if you have the accel pedal to the floor? (shutting off the injectors)

No not right up.....but can usually get it to catch on that first set of extended cranking. If I don't I have to stop, and start cranking again then it fires. Sometimes once it fires it gets blubbery and wideband goes rich, sometimes it doesn't.......

Even e85 it still starts bad - just not AS bad......still extended cranking.

GST Motorsports · Aug 6, 2009, 11:41 AM

but it starts up better with the pedal to the floor VS not touching it?

travman · Aug 6, 2009, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GST Motorsports

but it starts up better with the pedal to the floor VS not touching it?

Yes definitely starts better on e85 when i start cranking then push the pedal to the floor.....

haven't had 93 in it enough to fully determine if its the same case but it probably is..

GST Motorsports · Aug 6, 2009, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travman

Yes definitely starts better on e85 when i start cranking then push the pedal to the floor.....

haven't had 93 in it enough to fully determine if its the same case but it probably is..

Ok so too much fuel.

I wonder if something is causing the injectors to leak and pool up.

fixem2 · Aug 6, 2009, 11:55 AM

Anyway, your injectors are not setup correct? Do you have a log to share?

travman · Aug 6, 2009, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GST Motorsports

Ok so too much fuel.

I wonder if something is causing the injectors to leak and pool up.

Well I thought that on my first set - had the company send me a new set to try, took the old set and put them in my friends car who runs the same injectors but no starting issues - and i have started his car and its like stock.

His car fired fine after sitting for 30 min when mine does not with the same injectors......I pretty much ruled out the injectors at that point.

Also I notice when i push the pedal down the crank speed increases which would be from more air, usually when i hear this is when it fires up......

GST Motorsports · Aug 6, 2009, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travman

Also I notice when i push the pedal down the crank speed increases which would be from more air, usually when i hear this is when it fires up......

Which again goes back to me saying too much fuel is the problem.

What the cause is, is the issue.

travman · Aug 6, 2009, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fixem2

Anyway, your injectors are not setup correct? Do you have a log to share?

I will certainly get a log.......

Yes as far as I know they are setup correct....my trims last night were -1 low, -1 mid, 0 high. Up until last night I haven't flashed the car in weeks........

I run the same scaling as my friends car, but a slight difference in variation on the latencies.

GST Motorsports · Aug 6, 2009, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travman

I run the same scaling as my friends car, but a slight difference in variation on the latencies.

Did you log the cranking voltage on both cars?

travman · Aug 6, 2009, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GST Motorsports

Which again goes back to me saying too much fuel is the problem.

What the cause is, is the issue.

yeah - that is the issue for sure.

I have done a FP leak down test as per OEM manual and it does not seem to be abnormal from what would be "spec".

Basically its like this:

Clamp return hose..... bleed stops = FPR issue

Still bleeds down clamp the fuel feed....bleed stops = fuel pump leak

Still bleeds = fuel injector leak

mrfred · Aug 6, 2009, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fixem2

Anyway, your injectors are not setup correct? Do you have a log to share?

He's using the Bosch/ID1000 injectors. I've traded messages with several people who are using these injectors, and only one person has had any luck with warm starts. I'm beginning to think that there are other tables that have an effect on startup fueling.

fixem2 · Aug 6, 2009, 01:24 PM

Would this point to an injector issue and capatability? Using FIC 1050 and this issue is not present. (After IPW table changes)

travman · Aug 6, 2009, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fixem2

Would this point to an injector issue and capatability? Using FIC 1050 and this issue is not present. (After IPW table changes)

No.....it is not the injectors, and I don't want it to turn into that - read my posts how the injectors were tried in another car that started fine and worked with the set of injectors that didn't start up fine on my car. It seems it happens with all injectors/brands and its more one car starts great another doesn't.....there is a common variable among us, but what is it?

I had the same warm start issue on 1050's on 93 but not on E85..these injectors I have the issue on both fuels just e85 not as bad.

I have adjusted my IPW table every which way and I dont even sense a hint of something getting better. My friend who has these and his car starts perfect zero'd out his ipw table and his car still started perfect in all conditions. Now why is that?

GST Motorsports · Aug 6, 2009, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travman

I have adjusted my IPW table every which way and I dont even sense a hint of something getting better. My friend who has these and his car starts perfect zero'd out his ipw table and his car still started perfect in all conditions. Now why is that?

You sure you have that table defined correctly? It makes a change everytime I tweak with it. Putting it to zero on my personal Evo it will not want to start at all on E85.